LucianRoy said: Both Laby and Floofs voted for Kit at a time where Kit wasn’t heavily suspected, and neither were they. Bussing isn’t something people do all the time and for no reason. I guess then there’s me left if you want to believe in your theory so much. And I’ll admit that my vote isn’t looking too great at the end of the train. Bussing is something I would expect quite often from scum. Often enough to make things like VCA hard to work with. Are you saying that if scum!Lamby and scum!Floofs, (either), are bussing here, they're doing it for no reason? I don't see why you're trying to explain here because I often find that scum do bus for a reason, and that reason is to look good. Also, you don't have to believe me, you just have to argue with me. Of course it’d make them look innocent, but what’s the point in voting for your scum buddy, when you’re not being scum-read yourself at all, at the time? They were being seen as neutral by most people, so why casually vote for one of your 2 (!)* scum buddies just to increase your innocent factor a little bit? It’s different when you yourself are already a suspect, then you and your whole team benefit from bussing. But when you’re not suspected, lynching your team member just eliminates your chances to win the game. I guess I’m seeing this a lot from my own perspective, and how I play as scum. For me, bussing is always pretty much my last option. I’d never mindlessly vote for my scum buddy. And from what I’ve seen, while there are exceptions, most people when they’re scum are going from A to B. They’re doing exactly what they think it takes to win the game as scum: avoid being lynched yourself, make sure your buddies aren’t lynched, kill townies at night. Sure, there are some who make it their goal to confuse everyone, but voting for your partner is always risky and most people play it safe imo. I understand that you don’t want to let scum slip through your fingers, so you don’t want to dismiss someone just because they voted for Kit. But after looking at everyone’s votes, I don’t see anyone on Kit’s train who could have bussed him. * I'm emphasizing this because I think bussing is even riskier and less desirable when there are only 3 mafia members. No one wants to lose 1/3 of their team. LucianRoy said: quote]I guess this is something we do very differntly. I’m quick to eliminate someone from my pool of suspects when they’ve been voted for by scum or vice versa. At least I don’t expect half of the mafia to vote for each other the whole time, w/o having a good reason to do so. So to me it’s quite obvious (or at least I’m making the assumption) that Skittles isn’t mafia. Yeah, that doesn't exactly work for me when I play. I often assume scum bus, (because optimal strategy and site-meta), so I really try to weed out what looks like a bus and what doesn't. The reason VCA doesn't always work is because often times bussing is overlooked imo.[/quote] LucianRoy said: Hm.. I’ll admit I didn’t pay much attention to floofs during D1, and when I looked at the votes, I didn’t see how his mid-day vote for Kit could actually come from a mafia member. And I still don’t see *why* scum-Floofs would do that. Could you point me to where they voted in the middle of the day? The only vote I recall from them came after Lamby voted for Kit, which was nearing the end of the phase. You're right that he voted for him more towards the end of the day, but I still don't think Laby was bussing Kit here. When Laby voted for Kit, the votes were tied between Zymf, grrr and Kit. All of them had 2 votes. This doesn’t look like a classic bussing scenario to me, because with all of them having 2 votes, nothing had been decided yet. Kit wasn’t doomed, Laby wasn’t a suspect. So as scum, why would he vote for his partner here? LucianRoy said: I guess where I disagree with you the most is, that you don’t feel like lynching Abu, but Laby is on the lynchable pile. Why? Abu is out of the pile at the moment because of Kit's interactions with him. It's a stretch, and I don't expect people to see or even understand it too well, so you not being okay with it makes sense. Lamby is always lynchable Their vote on Kit alone doesn't clear them in any way shape or form imo. As noted, he hasn't given the best reasoning for his votes this game. LucianRoy said: „ I am not completely dismissing the theories of two scum off, or even two scum on“ Um, yes you are. At least for now, I guess. Yeah, you're right. I lied. But as I said, I don't find those believable atm. Maybe someone can explain two scum off well enough, but is everyone on that train town? Does that really happen? I would be very surprised to say the least. It's possible, but I find it unlikely. After going through the D1 posts and looking at people’s reasons for voting Kit, I still believe no one on Kit’s train is mafia. If anything, my vote stands out as the most suspicious because it’s at the end of the train and I voted about 10 min. before phase change. - yurkin voted for him the entire day. - Logic has to be town too, or at least not mafia, based on how he pushed Kit’s lynch together with you. - Laby broke the tie between grrr, Zymf and Kit, when all of them had 2 votes. This doesn’t strike me as scum behavior. If someone was bussing, then it might have been Floofs. Although I’m still thinking he’s town. I’ll reply to the rest later, I need a break. |
LucianRoy said: yurkin said: Am i being unclear again... :< Some posts, but not kits posts tho, i've took as a something comming from a scum buddies, ofc maybe im being silly lol It's possible to look at it that way in hindsight, but if you had that view at that time during D1, that could be classified as a pre-flip association. Pre-flip associations aren't exactly the most substantial thing to base suspicions off of unfortunately. Well sure, whatever you say. Im just mentiong it as a by the way stuff rather than anything roy. ;3 add: um pre-flip but + after flip as well, see them the same way. |
yurkinJul 15, 2017 11:04 AM
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AbuHumaid said: Wow I didn't except my post to get this much attention, I'll respond to everyone slowly After that if you may tell your view on karote, his vote on grr and all, quoted in #995. |
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yurkin said: I know he's not a priority but wow we are not actually focusing on him he still needs to help town because he is Anton town by definition of his role and also because he said that he would. So my question is what does him helping Town look like to you not what is his line man should we vote him or any of that I actually want to know how you feel he could help town?@logic340 #695 "thoughts on skittles?" "would you be willing to vote with me to share his thought?" Unfortonately i dont have such >: i recall only one post with some content. He answered himself on the 2nd part. I'll vote for my suspects.. "what would zymf helping town at this point (since we do need to keep him in mind) look to you?" I keep him in mind, but i prefer not to wifom myself over zymf, like how theconq did d1, so to speak zymf is not priority today. |
Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC  |
yurkin said: Honestly off the top of my head no I'm not sure. I'll look back and see if I can figure it out. Why aren't you voting them (whoever they are)?logic340 said: also why aren't you currently voted now that you've checked in? Also you're lower on my list of properties and higher on my read list than 4 of the others are currently. No specific reason, i was not here today thats all, you can guess from yesterday whom i want to vote for right, it had not changed even after today's posts. |
| Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
| Okay, I am back! Time to solve this game :D Day 1 - Game begin - Zymf claim pro-town TPR (Unlyncher) - Grrr counterclaim TPR (lover) - More stuff... - Kit is lynched (Evil) Night 1 - TheConqueror is killed (Innocent) Analysing the train on Kit The train on Kit began already in RVS in yurkins first post in the game (#103). @LucianRoy soon followed up with another vote, asking if there was any problem with both him and Logic340 having a neutral read on Kit, despite being the 3 top posters (#149) - I never really understood this question, care to explain? Even with the added explanation in #405, I didn't see why a neutral read or a low presence is "strange" or what one should be able to deduce from it. logic340 voted for Kit in #553 without an added explanation. Though he in posts explain why her, floofs and whisper give him slight scum vibes and also ask other players for their attention. He is not directly attacking Kit, but instead creates an increased focus on Kit, which is generally townish thing to do (except it's a common playstyle for logic). If you are bussing your scumbuddy, you would want to at least collect some town credits from it by being more agressive or you would instead try to divert attention. (#528 and #550) Next is @Laby-Gaga who casually throw out his vote on Kit in #586 in his usual meta-style and without much explanation other than "someone needs to get necked". You didn't add any explaination in earlier or later posts either, so could you please explain now why you decided to vote on Kit at the time? Floofs voted for Kit #616. From all the votes so far, this is the most likely to be just simple sheeping or bussing. Floofs refered all the way back to post #54 as the basis for her vote and only after LucianRoy pointed out that she hadn't voted anyone yet. After having also voted on coromandel, LucianRoy switch back to voting Kit in #667. In it he refers to previous reasoning along with a wish to "consolidate town votes on one single lynch". This goes along well with Lucians very pro-town and "professional" playstyle, which makes this seem pretty genuine to me. The final vote on Kit was from coromandel in #720. At the time, there were 5 votes on Kit and 4 on grrr with 3 minuttes left before phase change Therefore coromandel could easily have caused a tie by voting on grrr, but instead choose to lock the lynch onto Kit. Even if coromandel was scum, I think he would be experienced enough to not pull off a risky last minute rescue of a scumbuddy. But he could have chosen to just leave his vote as is, and just hope that someone else would be stupid enough to vote grrr in the last seconds... So from all this I trust LucianRoy the most followed closely by logic340. Laby-Gaga i trust a little, whereas I don't trust Floof at all. vote: Floof |
ZymfJul 15, 2017 2:25 PM
LucianRoy said: coromandel said: This makes me think Floofs isn't mafia. (bolded parts) He kept talking about Kit's question towards Abu, how he thought that it was confusing and/or didn't make sense to Floofs. This doesn't seem to come from a mafia buddy. Why would he as scum make a bid deal out of 1 sentence and point out Kit's mistake? @LucianRoy This is the type of analysis I was looking for on floofs, and I'm somewhat suprised to see it coming from your slot. I had different thoughts on this. Circumstantially. But I am uncertain if they'really conclusive. Do thsee posts from floofs read like he's viewing the game top-down? What I mean by this is, do you believe that Floofs had the actual prowess to scum read kit off of 1 interaction on page 2? Do these posts read like he has information not privy to town? Are the conclusions he comes to logical from a town perspective, or are they fabricated? These are the questions I asked myself when weighing the strength of this kind of evidence, and these are the questions I'm asking you. "Do thsee posts from floofs read like he's viewing the game top-down? What I mean by this is, do you believe that Floofs had the actual prowess to scum read kit off of 1 interaction on page 2? Do these posts read like he has information not privy to town? Are the conclusions he comes to logical from a town perspective, or are they fabricated?" I don't know, it's hard to tell. I didn't see the scumminess in Kit's question (still don't), but that doesn't mean no one else can. And I don't see how it could possibly be a scum-motivated post. If Floofs was Kit's scum buddy, why would he blow this out of proportion? Maybe Floofs was simply overthinking? Floofs said: If I was scum reading you I would vote for you. I have your alignment as a town lean, but I don't find post #54 alignment indicative for you since you do not see where I am coming from. For kit, it gives off scum vibes. The wording of it does not sound genuine from a town perspective and is misleading. Could have asked, Why wouldn't you vote no lynch early on in the game or Since it's not something you like to do early on, is it something that you would consider later in the game? Abu gave the right response to that question, but that doesn't change the fact that I find it as misleading. |
MrSkittles94 said: It's strange that everyone is on me, I mean I had it coming, I never talked and that for this game is suspect af, but it's fine I guess. You really don't no need to pressure me on anything I understand you just want to push me to out myself. Whisper knows that I'm more cool and collected then that, anyway enough of that I'll look more into Abu before I head off to work today, I won't be on again till little after 7pm EST. Just give y'all the heads up. Could you give us a list and tell us what you think about each player? Or just explain who you think is most likely scum? MrSkittles94 said: Oh? I see your game, just bating me out with a vote. Alright then. So be it. I've been reading thank you very much, anyway interesting how @coro and @logic are going at it, I'm just on the sidelines right now not really wanting to step in. Honestly at this point I wanna put a vote out for one reason. @coro seems to be pushing way way way to hard on everything I don't know why. @grr...I think that's right is also doing the same. Haven't read anything new so my assumptions could be completely wrong. But I will withhold my vote till I feel like I've made the right decision. Why don't you want to step in? |
Floofs said: I didn't dip out. I'm still here. Your opinion may have changed, but I am town reading all of the other players on this train. Why were you townreading yurkin, laby and logic at that time? |
| I havent read much from the last 3 pages. But if coronondel is not a town this game i will throw away my corometer and i will never trust it again. I hope i will have time to catch up tomorrow, but i doubt i will change my vote. |
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Shinichi-Kun said: lol ignore the post by last that got deleted i responded to a quote for me forgetting i was on my brothers pc XD |
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| @yourkin if you were town who will you kill with your ability. |
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coromandel said: Of course it’d make them look innocent, but what’s the point in voting for your scum buddy, when you’re not being scum-read yourself at all, at the time? They were being seen as neutral by most people, so why casually vote for one of your 2 (!)* scum buddies just to increase your innocent factor a little bit? It’s different when you yourself are already a suspect, then you and your whole team benefit from bussing. But when you’re not suspected, lynching your team member just eliminates your chances to win the game. I guess I’m seeing this a lot from my own perspective, and how I play as scum. For me, bussing is always pretty much my last option. I’d never mindlessly vote for my scum buddy. And from what I’ve seen, while there are exceptions, most people when they’re scum are going from A to B. They’re doing exactly what they think it takes to win the game as scum: avoid being lynched yourself, make sure your buddies aren’t lynched, kill townies at night. Sure, there are some who make it their goal to confuse everyone, but voting for your partner is always risky and most people play it safe imo. I understand that you don’t want to let scum slip through your fingers, so you don’t want to dismiss someone just because they voted for Kit. But after looking at everyone’s votes, I don’t see anyone on Kit’s train who could have bussed him. * I'm emphasizing this because I think bussing is even riskier and less desirable when there are only 3 mafia members. No one wants to lose 1/3 of their team. Yeah, that doesn't exactly work for me when I play. I often assume scum bus, (because optimal strategy and site-meta), so I really try to weed out what looks like a bus and what doesn't. The reason VCA doesn't always work is because often times bussing is overlooked imo. LucianRoy said: Could you point me to where they voted in the middle of the day? The only vote I recall from them came after Lamby voted for Kit, which was nearing the end of the phase. You're right that he voted for him more towards the end of the day, but I still don't think Laby was bussing Kit here. When Laby voted for Kit, the votes were tied between Zymf, grrr and Kit. All of them had 2 votes. This doesn’t look like a classic bussing scenario to me, because with all of them having 2 votes, nothing had been decided yet. Kit wasn’t doomed, Laby wasn’t a suspect. So as scum, why would he vote for his partner here? LucianRoy said: Abu is out of the pile at the moment because of Kit's interactions with him. It's a stretch, and I don't expect people to see or even understand it too well, so you not being okay with it makes sense. Lamby is always lynchable Their vote on Kit alone doesn't clear them in any way shape or form imo. As noted, he hasn't given the best reasoning for his votes this game. LucianRoy said: Yeah, you're right. I lied. But as I said, I don't find those believable atm. Maybe someone can explain two scum off well enough, but is everyone on that train town? Does that really happen? I would be very surprised to say the least. It's possible, but I find it unlikely. After going through the D1 posts and looking at people’s reasons for voting Kit, I still believe no one on Kit’s train is mafia. If anything, my vote stands out as the most suspicious because it’s at the end of the train and I voted about 10 min. before phase change. - yurkin voted for him the entire day. - Logic has to be town too, or at least not mafia, based on how he pushed Kit’s lynch together with you. - Laby broke the tie between grrr, Zymf and Kit, when all of them had 2 votes. This doesn’t strike me as scum behavior. If someone was bussing, then it might have been Floofs. Although I’m still thinking he’s town. I’ll reply to the rest later, I need a break. You've convinced me... Vote: Floofs ...that you are not scum. And, you are approaching this game from the perspective of town. Moving on to Floofs, who is at the moment, the big question mark in this equation. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
| Note to self: LucianRoy made really good points as to why lastwhisper is town in #781 (+reads in general) @coromandel, you also made a quite a reads list in #821. I agree with most of it, but it would help if you found some examples on how lastwhisper and RE might have tried to create another train to save Kit. logic340 said: Where did you soft claim o.o (must have been a part I didn't read)LucianRoy said: Yeah I figured as well but I really though you or I would be dying tonight. I wonder what made them choose TheConq but I wont dwell on it too much. I think you and I need to work on getting zymf to work and vote along side us today.This is what I foresaw. You were the only one to soft a PR yesterday, and Kit made the optimal play. Also, don't worry - I will cooperate as long as you don't lynch me. Kit said: Curious: What is CFD?CFD is truly the MS way LucianRoy said: Hmmm.. interresting!This caught my attention post-flip. @Logic340 If Kit was being doomed to the gallows at this stage in the game, what purpose do they have in trying to link me and floofs when Kit obviously knows I'm not scum? If Floofs is mafia, then on the surface Kit would be trying to pair a scumbuddy with a strong town player - But on a deeper level, Kit would know it to be a bad idea once she flipped, as it instead creates a connection between Kit and Floofs. Perhaps Kit made a slip, and didn't think her actions through? If Floofs is town, then on the surface Kit was trying to divert attention away from herself. Though after the flip she just cleared not only 1 but 2 townies. ? LucianRoy said: ಠ_ಠ - Tell me your flavor, would you please?If you knew my role, the way I'm playing would make sense. That's all I'm going to say. logic340 said: Perhaps you were "possesed" (as in redirected), though since you were also roleblocked, it didn't matter? I know nothing about it though...Also I would like to inform everyone that at the start of the night phase I felt a presence inside my body. Not sure what that means so maybe some of you can help me figure that out. I doubt that as soon as kit died I was RB'd because I was notified during the Day that my ability was blocked. Though if it happened right after the day phase ended, then maybe it was not someone else that targeted you, but instead a hidden ability/effect you have... It is bastard after all (or it could just be a day active ofc). /I'm at page 18 (from reading Day 2). I'm gonna call it for today... |
| Preferably, I still want to hear logic's thoughts on Coro because at this point, it comes down to a matter of gut for me. Finding any possible scum off the train will be tremendously more dificult than sorting those on it from my perspective. @Logic340, do you think Coro's theory of two scum off is plausible? |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
| @Zymf For your question to me in 1007, it's actually a little tricky to explain, but it's a matter of perspective. The quesion is there in the post. Why do the number one and number two posters not have a solid read on the third highest poster in the thread? Shouldn't there be more than enough content to properly read them? Why are we not getting any town vibes? Why are we not getting any scum vibes? And in essence, this leads to the question: are they masking their behavior to make it dificult to read them? And, why do they not want to be read? From there on, the logic should be somewhat self-explanatory. And a CFD stands for a Chinese fire drill, (or change in fucking direction depending on what site you like to play). In general, it's used to refer to the mass switch of votes on someone, usually this is coordinated, to achieve a lynch. So, let's say there's a big train, and the leader of the train gets doubtful towards the end of the phase, so they rally everyone to switch their votes to another person. Let's say there isn't a train at all, and people just conglomerate at the end of the phase and blitz somebody they agree upon. That's CFD. And it isn't exactly optimal play, unless there are very good circucumstances constituting the switch. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
grrr said: um....I'd call it a friendly duel. I think we both benefitted from it. @logic can you summarize in 10 words or less your fight with lucian from day 1? Who won? It seems lucianis winning day 2 Zymf said: Note to self: LucianRoy made really good points as to why lastwhisper is town in #781 (+reads in general) logic340 said: Where did you soft claim o.o (must have been a part I didn't read)Yeah I figured as well but I really though you or I would be dying tonight. I wonder what made them choose TheConq but I wont dwell on it too much. I think you and I need to work on getting zymf to work and vote along side us today. Also, don't worry - I will cooperate as long as you don't lynch me. Zymf said: I was also thinking it could e some random effect from being on her train? Some kind of RNG for those on the lynch train? Or maybe Kit's real ability?logic340 said: Perhaps you were "possesed" (as in redirected), though since you were also roleblocked, it didn't matter? I know nothing about it though...Also I would like to inform everyone that at the start of the night phase I felt a presence inside my body. Not sure what that means so maybe some of you can help me figure that out. I doubt that as soon as kit died I was RB'd because I was notified during the Day that my ability was blocked. Though if it happened right after the day phase ended, then maybe it was not someone else that targeted you, but instead a hidden ability/effect you have... It is bastard after all (or it could just be a day active ofc). |
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| I do think it's plausible. I feel similarly to get about Laby. I also remember feeling like Karore at first when Floofs voted Kit but their issuing posts made me feel better about them. As stated Floofs was obvious scum in his scum game and looked like newbie town in his first game (tpr). Off meta (which I discussed with Kit) Kit's RVS and later vote on floofs, floofs, vote on kit, and the EoD posting, I'm at a town lean on floofs. From my point of view that would leave Coro in with the string of townie post she has right now I'm just not seeing her as scum painting herself into a corner like this? So it looks like all town imo. |
| Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
| @LucianRoy I feel better about Floofs than I do spot Skittles or Karote. Edit that being said I'm not mad at your vote as floofs needs to contribute and show he's town. Along with the two mentioned above. |
| Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
AbuHumaid said: it seemed to cause some confusion I didn't really find much confusing about it but I will try to clear that up since you're taking your time. Wow I didn't except my post to get this much attention, I'll respond to everyone slowly I would really like to hear from you and your thoughts on everybody's thoughts on what you had to say. Also out of the the other less active people (Karote, Floofs, Skittles) that I've been discussing. Who are you most suspicious of and why? |
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AbuHumaid said: Please correct me if I got anything wrong.RE1031 said: Yurkin wasn't defending me she was just giving her read on me. I wasn't pressured or pushed at that point at all so it's not considered defending.I want to focus on yurkin and Abu again, and possibly Karote. As much as I hate to, gonna have to ignore grrr. I recall yurkin defending Abu simply by contrasting his tones as mafia and as town (found it - #450). I did believe it at first, but considering how bad my town reads have been so far, I'm revisiting this. Why does someone townread another based on this and leave it alone? I don't see any strong justification behind townreading Floofs and Abu. I find it strange that two players who left little impression on others should stand out to yurkin, but given that she was one of the people who voted for Kit, I think I'm gonna give her a free pass first. Honestly, everything Karote has done so far kind of slipped my mind. The only other game I've played with him was when he was confirmed town, which I believe had a negative impact on his activity, so I don't think that should be the case here. He did have internet issues, but I'm gonna have to reread posts to see if content is worthy. Also what did you do to my name. ___ vote: Abu @AbuHumaid Is there anything besides coromandel's "bussing" that makes her scum? Because that's an interesting reason if it stands alone. I know you were in a game (Easter Egg) where you were bussed, but coro's vote kind of made the final call between determining who between Kit and grrr were lynched (unlike Crossbell who voted you halfway through the train, I think). If she's scum, then she and the other buddy probably could have swayed the lynch towards grrr. So I'm finding your reasoning strange. Yes Kit's post in https://xss.now.cc/forum/?topicid=1635092&show=550#msg51498531 well nevermind Logic but isn't it weird how she gave you and Coro a free town read? i'm not only suspecting Coro right now but you too, you were defending Kit so much which is mad sus, Coro is giving me a Sailor Moon mafia vibe where she was scum, iirc Coro is way less active when she's town no? but she seems so active here. you two are reminding me of Coro and Ruu scum team in Sailor moon mafia game, they were working together but still disagreeing with each other here and there to not make it obvious, like when in Day 1 Coro changed her vote and bussed her scum buddy Kit with a half assed reason "Is grrr's train any better? Karote is voting for him, and I don't really know why..?" -Coro and you were like "oh you have a point" like wtf? that's not even a good reason -Says yurkin was not defending him. -Says nvmd logic (obv town?). -Questions Kit's read on coro. -Tells RE she was defending Kit. -Coro gives him Sailor Moon mafia vibes. I feel similar vies but this in itself is not enough to say she is scum. -Says coro was less active as town. Not sure when he saw a town game to compare against? I have no personal knowledge to say either way. -Says RE and coro remind him of Ruu and coro scum team in Sailor Moon. -Explains why he feels that way. -Believes that coro voted her scum buddy Kit with half ass reason and quotes it. -Says he doesn't like RE's reason for agreeing with coro's point about the grrr train. This is how I read this and I am ot really sure where the confusion is coming from? |
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coromandel said: Karote said: Dunno, I can just say I'm more likely to believe Zymf over grr and I think grr goal is not to lynch Zymf but something else. I'm townreading RE, her posts seem town-ish imo. Suspecting Kit kind of, her posts seem full of participating but the content isn't actually much. For example she scumreads Lucian for buddying up with Logic after going after him and then everyone townreads them both which reminds her of past mafia games. Alright well, I think coro explained well why it's not that scummy for Lucian to back off. Just because something in other mafia games, doesn't always guarantee happen same here so that scumread feels weak. Altough most people Karote said: She posts a lot (in first few pages at least) but nothing of it is much of helping to catch scum. I know. From your first posts, it seemed like you suspected Kit, and you didn't mention that you scumread Floofs. Then 1 vote by Floof changed your mind and you voted for grrr instead? Why? Idk, maybe so there wasnt two scums on one train? is that a thing? idk but its always a possibility. Edit: IMO I see nothing wrong with scum lynching scum if need be, Im a douche like that, but like coro said, when most people switched to kit, there was literally no reason to, if you were mafia, to lets say jump on ur own mates lynch train when all the votes were pretty much tied. |
_WispJul 15, 2017 6:55 PM
| blinddate she was never awake even with her eyes wide open never where she longed to be and if you’d meet her just know you were on a blind date with a dreamer |
logic340 said: I do think it's plausible. I feel similarly to get about Laby. I also remember feeling like Karore at first when Floofs voted Kit but their issuing posts made me feel better about them. As stated Floofs was obvious scum in his scum game and looked like newbie town in his first game (tpr). Off meta (which I discussed with Kit) Kit's RVS and later vote on floofs, floofs, vote on kit, and the EoD posting, I'm at a town lean on floofs. From my point of view that would leave Coro in with the string of townie post she has right now I'm just not seeing her as scum painting herself into a corner like this? So it looks like all town imo. I see you're more familiar with Floofs than I am, so I'm willing to put them on the back-burner for the moment and narrow things down from the town-block perspective. Lamby is still not cleared fmpov. Vote: Karote @Karote, please tell me about your scumreads and townreads, preferably with reasoning. logic340 said: @LucianRoy I feel better about Floofs than I do spot Skittles or Karote. Edit that being said I'm not mad at your vote as floofs needs to contribute and show he's town. Along with the two mentioned above. I am going to buy into the two scum off theory for right now, minus Lamb because I don't feel he's been vetted thoroughly enough. My lynch-pool has changed to these four names in this order: Karote, Abu, Skittles, and Lamby. Meaning, that if I were instantly in an isolated vacuum and could no longer interact with these players in any way shape or form, I would lynch them in the order of Karote->Abu->Skittles->Lamb. And that is how I would solve the game though PoE, but it is shaky, and I feel there are many loose ends I haven't tied up only because people haven't been the most active. This approach also doesn't factor in Grr/Zymf. And to be perfectly fair, if we kill one more group scum, Isolate the last through power-roles, VCA, interactions, etc, and have a majority of town in the dead-chat, we could take a phase to sort them out and lynch between Grr/Zymf as long as our RB from the dead chat always prevents a town-kill. And this I believe, is a somewhat general, but nonetheless decent approach to winning the game. We have <19 hours before this phase ends, and we need to start thinking about consolidating town votes on a single lynch. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
| Whats this scum off theory you're referring to? @LucianRoy |
| blinddate she was never awake even with her eyes wide open never where she longed to be and if you’d meet her just know you were on a blind date with a dreamer |
Ok. I'll explain this a bit in-depth. This explanation will have to cover a couple topics, including overall meta surrounding optimal scumplay in the current meta, and that specific topic I am no expert in at all, but I understand it, somewhat. That will be really hard to explain because it's really more of an experience thing, but the concept can still be expounded upon. First thing's first: Scum bus. Scum take credit for lynching their partners in order to have much better chances of winning the game in smaller numbers. The reverse of this is defending you scumbuddy, and unlike bussing, this is very difficult to do well, thus the meta around optimal, (or even easy), scumplay is to bus your partners if they are ever in a jam, going to be lynched by town, looking scummy, playing poorly, make mistakes, etc. When you play as scum, it is very easy to find reasons why your partners are scum, (mostly because you know they're scum). Scum bussing can be rational, or illogical depending on the type of players and skill level. I am not going to mention my scum meta here. Many experienced players bus vote, they do not always bus-lynch. I make a distinction here because good scum can, and often will, plan out their actions together and leave a very complicated voting pattern the could have focused on their buddies, and it could not have. This is a good strategy to make things like VCA far less ineffective in the late-game. It's really subjective, and it very dependent on play-style and how one personally chooses to play as scum, but I find it a good idea when playing town to hold scum to high-standards such as these in order to play carefully, and minimize my chances for making mistakes. Like, for instance, let's say a scum got by in my process of elimination. Now that wouldn't be very good. Now we're at the topic of 1 scum on and one scum off, 2 scum on, or two scum off. It's easy to do here because we know how many group-scum there are. Normally, scum operate with two different things they use to confuse town. These things are called buddying, and distancing. Depending on the type of player you are, you might favor one over the other. If you want to distance yourself from your buddy, it's pretty explanatory, you keep your distance. If you want to buddy them, (or other town for that matter), you get in their good graces through any means usually. If scum want to bus, and they've distanced themselves from their partner, they are in an opportune spot to vote their partner. If they've gone the opposite direction and buddied their partner, not so much. Which brings up where scum would fall on a scum lynch. Let's say, one buddied and one distanced, one wants to bus, and one would look very scummy if they voted their partner, this would result in 1 scum being on the train and 1 scum being off the train. I know you might be thinking I'm a know-it-all, but I'm actually quite poor at explaining this and there are people far better than me at theory. Those are the real know-it-alls. Hopefully this answered your question in a very detailed and roundabout way. And holy shit, if people here know I know all of this my scum meta is destroyed. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
| Wait, I forgot to explain it from my perspective. So I said I had a theory in my large post, that theory was that there was 1 scum on the train yesterday, (one scum who bussed), and one scum off the train. I went about today identifying the unknowns on the train, (which in my opinion are much easier to tackle), rather than trying to locate the scum off the train, (more akin to a needle in a haystack). And that is why I had a lot of comments and questions to make about floofs, Lamby, and Coro, and I did not try to focus on people such as Karote. People I consider to be town disagree with me, so I am trying to approach it differently midday I suppose. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
| If any of the stuff I talk about here sounds crazy/ like a foreign language/ far too complicated, my best advice is to play more mafia. You don't even have to believe in any of this to play the game, it's all just theory. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
LucianRoy said: If any of the stuff I talk about here sounds crazy/ like a foreign language/ far too complicated, my best advice is to play more mafia. You don't even have to believe in any of this to play the game, it's all just theory. No I understand just fine, I guess figuring out what mafia thought is part of the challenge. |
| blinddate she was never awake even with her eyes wide open never where she longed to be and if you’d meet her just know you were on a blind date with a dreamer |
Vote Count 2.2 Karote (2)-Coromandel, lucian Abu (2)-Re103, Last Zymf (1)-Grrr, Mr Skittles (1)-Logic Coro (1)-Abu Floofs(1)-Zymf Not Voting: MrSkittles,Karote, yurkin, flofs, lamby Just going to keep it as flofs XD This correct? |
  |
logic340 said: I'm home going back to the start if day two. @LucianRoy how much longer will you be available before you're V/LA? @lastwhisper31 since Skittles is your real life friend I'd like you to try and keep him active in the thread. It's D2 you guys have some great information to go on so share your thoughts and please try to encourage him to as well. @AbuHumaid you got a very informative flip who do you think is town? How do you feel about grrr's claim? @grrr other than zymf who do you suspect? @Floofs who do you think are Kit's scum buddies and why? Re1435 but no where near as much as zymf. |
| |
| Subcociously you want to vote me even when i am town... nice to know. |
| |
coromandel said: Without reading to much into the content of this post, I doubt scum would put in this must effort just to spoiler it all.I’ll just add my 2 cents to everything you said in this post, like it or not. @LucianRoy /edit: bbcode logic340 said: You two are really buddy-buddy o.oLucianRoy said: Thanks for the vote of support I feel the same way about you. Glad we got to sorting each other early and that we both made it into D2. I have a feeling whoever mafia is was worried we would be watched or protected which is why we are both here now.Okay, so Logic is definitely town after that lynch yesterday. This is pretty self explanatory. Scum don't single-handedly push a lynch to completion on a buddy they're bussing D1. It doesn't happen. Besides both of you being pretty townish, I doubt you two could be unaligned... LucianRoy said: At least in my case, alignment has nothing to do with my activity level.I'm just going to tack on my 2 cents, but I find activity to not be indicative of alignment. Even in the context of meta. MrSkittles94 said: This feels like inactive and confused scum not knowing what to do or say.Oh? I see your game, just bating me out with a vote. Alright then. So be it. I've been reading thank you very much, anyway interesting how @coro and @logic are going at it, I'm just on the sidelines right now not really wanting to step in. Honestly at this point I wanna put a vote out for one reason. @coro seems to be pushing way way way to hard on everything I don't know why. @grr...I think that's right is also doing the same. Haven't read anything new so my assumptions could be completely wrong. But I will withhold my vote till I feel like I've made the right decision. Quick reads list Confident town reads: LucianRoy, Logic340 Town leans: lastwhisper31, Laby-Gaga, coromandel Scum leans: MrSkittles94, Floofs Haven't decided: AbuHumaid, RE1031, grrr, Karote, yurkin /At page 20 |
| @Shinichi-kun @Oyasumi_Rosie @Jackrito @Crossbell can we get a current vote count please? nevermind just noticed one a few posts above this one. Good morning all! |
logic340Jul 16, 2017 6:05 AM
| Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
| @Karote in addition to this I'd like your thoughts on Floofs and Skittles please? |
| Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
| I have played with yurkin the last few games and i am pretty sure she is mafia this game. But i dont want to vote her yet. I pike the toaster quotes : D. Maybe tomorrow. By the way i have misread my role. I am not a third party lover with ability to kill someone when draw votes hapen. I am actually a town doctor but it appears i saw what I wanted to see. I appologize deeply for that mistake :( . |
| |
| Just checking in, there are about 7 hours left in the phase, and I'm OK with the top two wagons right now. Preferably, town votes should be consolidated on Carrot imo. I don't feel like we're rally going to hear much from floofs or Abu... maybe Abu. |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
| Yes, she sounds ver devious and suspicios, while usually she sounds worried and happy. |
| |
grrr said: Yes, she sounds ver devious and suspicios, while usually she sounds worried and happy. Ahh, a tonal read. Do you think you could possibly point to a specific example from them where this is evident? |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
grrr said: I have played with yurkin the last few games and i am pretty sure she is mafia this game. But i dont want to vote her yet. I pike the toaster quotes : D. Maybe tomorrow. By the way i have misread my role. I am not a third party lover with ability to kill someone when draw votes hapen. I am actually a town doctor but it appears i saw what I wanted to see. I appologize deeply for that mistake :( . You'll be dissapointed then grr. lmao so no tpr, fun you got townread thanks to fakeclaiming. So why suspecting zymf again? |
|
| @ Skittles I'm on mobile, I just read over my posts a lot and fix mistakes. Also, I don't think Zymf is finding you scummy for your inactivity. But since you're here, do you have any players whose alignemnts you're confident of? |
| "If you look for a ghost, you'll find one." |
yurkin said: no that was not a counter claim@logic340 Btw logic did you cc-ed kit at eop d1, like did you catch her in fakeclaiming? i did not get what happened there :D |
| Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
| I think grrr is being stupid. I'm beginning to think that the only reason why he would keep up this charade for this long and why he is still so intent on lynching me is if he really is TPR lover and therefore "knows" that I'm lying and must be scum. But I am not, and if I was town grrr who had made a fake TPR claim I would have given up long ago, moved on and made a post like: "I was lying I am actually [insert new fakeclaim]. I was trying to have Zymf slip, but this is what I got instead yack yack yack..." Your thoughts on the interaction between coro and Lucian but more coro in general? I think it is a stretch to suspect someone for not reaching the same reads as oneself. Lucian didn't like coromandels reads list in #821, but I don't have any problem with it. I read most of coro's posts as productive town rather than manipulative scum, while Lucian is very pickety of them. I haven't read anything specific from coromandel that gives me a town read. Instead, it is his general approach.Lucian and I have differing opinions on lamb. After you read them could you share your thoughts on what you think and what you make of Lamb yourself? Could you point me to where you discuss Lamb exactly? You have a town lean on Laby-Gaga, but Lucian is not so sure? My thoughts on Lamb is that he is acting normal and he was on Kit's train D1.And also if you could pick one of the less active players (Abu, Karote, Floofs, Skittkes) of your choosing to share your thoughts with me about? Floofs and Skittles are both suspicious.please and thank you |
MrSkittles94 said: Zymf said: Im pancakes! I'm active just in spurts since on mobile, but why think I'm scum just cuz I can't really respond since my phone is crap when trying to respond? That's kinda strange to just assume that I am just cuz I can't really respond.Without reading to much into the content of this post, I doubt scum would put in this must effort just to spoiler it all. You two are really buddy-buddy o.o Besides both of you being pretty townish, I doubt you two could be unaligned... At least in my case, alignment has nothing to do with my activity level. This feels like inactive and confused scum not knowing what to do or say. Quick reads list Confident town reads: LucianRoy, Logic340 Town leans: lastwhisper31, Laby-Gaga, coromandel Scum leans: MrSkittles94, Floofs Haven't decided: AbuHumaid, RE1031, grrr, Karote, yurkin /At page 20 Right now you are hard to read because you've posted so little. Who are your scumreads? |
Zymf said: @coromandel, you also made a quite a reads list in #821. I agree with most of it, but it would help if you found some examples on how lastwhisper and RE might have tried to create another train to save Kit. That was the initial impression I had when D2 started, but after re-reading what happened during D1, I don't see it anymore. grrr said: Yes, she sounds ver devious and suspicios, while usually she sounds worried and happy. worried AND happy? o.0 |
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